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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
It seems that everyone that is a yamaha fan is very happy that the new r1 is more powerful than the 954.
Maybe you should check this out:
http://www.akrapovic-ai.si/main/productnews/product-news.htm
and compare it to:
http://www.akrapovic-ai.si/main/catalog/honda/cbr900rr_2002/evolution/default.htm

There goes the r1 advantage!
And that leaves the 954 owner with the more agile/better brakes/faster cornering bike ... he he !

P.S.1 the r1 still looks awesome, though
P.S.2 for those of faint hearts, please don't check the gsxr1000 page ...
 

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They look just about even from here... Yet the 954's curve looks like a roller coaster. Look at the torque dip in the low/mid range over stock. Not only that but look at the torque peak numbers... The R1 is above it yet again. The 954 is third best in power again.

Of other interest is the new R1's exhaust is 4-2-1 where mine is a 4-1. The 4-1 is better for making up the dip in power from removal of the exhaust valve. Weird that would change it.
 

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The difference in power between these two bikes will not be visible nor noticeable in a straight line.

Just remember what Honda says in their comercials:

"...it's not how fast you go but how fast you finish..."

If it's of any confort :)
 

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Ian it looks like your right on the peak torque but the R1 has a huge dip as well and it is further up the RPM range and also much larger

 

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Oops.

HP is a poor substitute for experience and ability.
 

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I think we're all forgeting that these bikes are built to go round corners. Not drag or do Dyno shoot outs/images/icons/tongue.gif

Plus <font color=blue>YAMAHA</font color=blue> kicks all the others ass's in the "everything considered" catagory.
 

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If your in love with your R1, why is your performance, horse power, stronger than any other bike ever produced, post not in the yamaha forum. It wasn't so bad coming to the HONDA forum and seeing it the first 300 times.The first step is admitting you have a problem, I am sure the Honda dealer would probably trade with you some how for the 954
 

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Hell - An intelligent dealer would take a 10 year-old FZR 600 in trade for a 954!!!/images/icons/laugh.gif

 

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Jeez there is a lot of 954RR bashing going on. What's the deal? I say, neither is hands down better than the other. What I say is, which ever one lasts longer is better off for those that like to ride their new bikes longer than a year or two. I was really motivated to trade or sell my current 97 900RR this year for something new and different, but I keep reading about this old 900RR that some sport rider editor rides that has nearly 200,000 miles on it and without a hickup. I think to myself, that so far my bike doesn't have a major power or technology deficit, and if treated well, and trust me, I treat mine very well, that it will reward me with many years of good riding. So far I haven't seen anything about the new bikes that suggests they are as strong in longevity as they are hp numbers. I know Yamaha R1 owners that have weak or about to die engines after average miles, and it is too early to tell if the 929 or 954RR's are as strong or even stronger that the old ones. SO I say who cares about an hp or two, buy what takes a beating and keeps on going strong. All major brands have raised performance to new heights and we benefot from it, but time will only tell which brands remembered to bring longevity with in the process. R1's are getting easier and cheaper to get around me and I am still in love with the look of them, but I just can't buy one till I know for sure from others experiences that they are built to last in the engine department.

If you wrote a book about your life, would anyone want to read it?
 

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MNerionrr~ Like you, I haven't seen a bike that is currently produced that I would trade my current bike for. Sure, newer bikes have more HP and the suspension/frame is different, but when pressed I still find my existing <font color=red>Honda</font color=red> to be more than able to do the things I need it to do. Hopefully both of our "old" RR's will be around at the 200,000 mile mark. /images/icons/smile.gif

 

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<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>

Jeez there is a lot of 954RR bashing going on.

<hr></blockquote>

Blame the guy who started this thread. He was the one who found matching peak hp numbers and claimed the R1 had lost its advantage as a result. He never bothered to look at the whole curve and ended up opening the floodgates for everyone else who did /images/icons/laugh.gif.

 

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Too chime in finally, since i am a Honda fan. Per Bike Magazine's review of the New R1 - "10th generation of the classic Honda thoroughbred is much revised in 2002. Quick, light, well-judged, but dont be misled though, this is the leanest and meanest of them all" I have rode a 01' 920 and the 02' can only be better! Well, Ill stay on the sidelines and be a spectator now.


Triumph Sprint ST
 

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Let me be the first to say that it damn sure isn't who has the fastest bike. I'm a new rider with around 2.5 months experience. My bike is brand new. I'm the slowest guy in the whole group, and funny how those slower, older bikes just seem to fly by my inexperience in the curves. I'm sure kenny roberts could jump on a 95 cbr 600 and show a huge majority of us his tail lights, even if we jumped on the newest gsxryzfcbr 100000. It ain't the dyno's, it's the guy telling the bike what to do, and how well he translates that to his inputs. All of these bikes are so close... if you are getting left behind on your group rides, you need practice, not 3 more hp.

my pathetic squid .02
 

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Just browsing forums. thought i would give a shout. About the comparo. I think whoever started this subject should have posted the dynos that are stock. The r1 has a clear advantage by about 5 rwhp atleast. Thats according to the mags and some people i know who have dynoed both on the same dyno this year. Comparing the 01 r1 to the 954 is a toss up. but the 02 r1 to the 954 i dont think there is a power debate. Its all about what you want in a bike.

Learn how to get it up!
 

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there is a debate, always a debate as long as mags like cycle world had a 954 test bike that put 136+hp and 71+tq to the rear wheel and MO says there 954 put only 130+ to the wheel, there is always a debate ... Honda R1 owners (r1 owners who wish they had a honda but are too scred to admit it) was claiming the r1 made so much more power than a 929 but it was only making 1 to 1-1/2hp more in reality even with 4 more valves and nearly 70 more cc's ... oh yeah, there will always be a debate /images/icons/tongue.gif

http://webpages.charter.net/fullforce
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
OK, this has gone far enough.
I personally agree totally with nottobright, in fact that's why I bought a 954 and not a gixxer1000, or a hayabusa/zx-12 for that matter!!! SPORT bikes are supposed to go well around corners!
If you read my post, you will see that I said that yamaha owners/fans were constantly bragging that the new R1 is more powerful than the 954. Well, like Ironman said, it is! No doubt about it!
My point was that all most of yamaha guys care about, or refer to, is maximum output. That's why I posted those two pages, because your point of view is annuled when you put a full system on both bikes, because honda's exhaust is more restrictive than yamaha's! Have you r1 guys checked the akrapovic's suzuki page? 152 at the rear wheel!!! That's what I call power ... Why don't you go brag to the suzuki forum??? Where's your max power now? Oh, and just wait untill honda releases their V5 ...
Ny2nj, got my point? I couldn't care less about peak power, I know that midrange is way more important, in fact, how much time do any of us spend at the redline and how much at the midrange? I had a SV650 (naked) that I regret I sold, but I just couldn't afford both. It made 70 hp at the crank, can you believe if I told you I was able to OBLITERATE a Hornet 600 (97hp) or even a thundercat (100hp) exitting corners? That's what I call midrange. That's how I was able to leave behind my more experienced friends, who owned them, in the twisties. And they were better riders than me! I only learned how to ride a bicycle 2 and a half years ago !!! A bicycle, for god's sake, not a bike! And I was still able to beat them! That's how a Mille (130hp crank/190kg) can beat the crap out of a gsxr1000 (164 real crank hp/170kg) on a circuit! And this was achived by several european bike magazines! I just posted that because all yamaha guys talk is max power, they are constantly bashing the 954 because of 2 or 3 MAX hp, it was just to shut their mouths. I know that the r1 has more midrange, even with the full system. My point was, if max output is really important to some of you, if you buy a 954 and put a full system, you will have the same max power than a r1 in the same conditions, and a better handling bike (not by far thought, the r1 has fantastic handling too).
I don't see suzuki owners in the yamaha forum bashing the r1. Why? Because they don't need to! Last year's ninja 9r, acording to some european publications that use dynos with forced air systems, when moving (using ram air) was more powerful than the r1, and had more top end speed. Do you see kawi fans bragging in other foruns? No, because they don't need to. Then why do r1 fans need to spend more time at the honda forum than yours, bashing the 954? Think about it... Oh, and how many r1 with 200.000 miles are out there? One? Two?
When I posted this, 453 people had already read my post. I'm just curious how many were yamaha owners...

I am not a honda fan, I was in the market for a new bike and I just got the 954 because there are a lot of corners here, and the 954 is the best handling of the four jap manufacturers. It just makes me sick all that bashing that is going around.
I would finally like to had that I know a guy that is a very very tallented rider, and owns a bandit600s. It just makes 78 at the crank, wheighs around 475 pounds and is awfull around corners. Can you belive that I am not able to overtake him on my 954 in the twisties, has long has there are no long straights? That's why I make si-lly_fast words my own...
I hope I made my points of view clear.

P.S. when I said sport bikes are supposed to go well around corners, I was refering to the busa/zx12, not the gixxer, which has great handling. My appologies to gsxr1000 owners/fans that might have been offended by my misleading statement. And while the two previous bikes also have good handling, they are just not in the same league.
 

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So you're saying a 12R or 'busa can't corner? Come on man, you sit here with this long disertation about how people shouldn't judge on power, but the whole bike... Well ride a 12R and for the "street" it handles just fine and you might just find one blowing by you and your best handling bike.

People love to equate weight with handling... Guys, ride any of the "larger" bikes, they are so much better streetbikes then the race reps and us mere mortals will never even remotely push any of them to the point we recognize problems. Yeah you might think one is a bit more sluggish on turnin and what not, but that's what suspension settings are for.

I have ridden a new 12R, get rid of that dam thing they call a rear tire and adjust the suspension and I know I will have no problems with 80-90% of the riders I ever encounter.
 
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